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That set looks nice but wouldn't Flare Blitz defeat the whole purpose of using Focus Sash because Flare Blitz gives recoil damage? I think Expert Belt or perhaps Petaya Berry or Salac Berry might work better there.

The Idea of the band is to ensure that typhlosion gets at least one howl in, to ensure some real damage (due to the fact that its defenses leave much to be desired) but a focus band might work just as well, if not better. More than likely, typhlosion wont be able to take a crit-quake and so, to make up for its poor defense, it needs something to ensure that it survives. if you get a second howl off (assuming you get lucky and the opponent wants to switch to counter typhlosion better), you can smash water types with thunderpunch. most standard pokemonll take a hard hit from flare blitz or earthquake.

thinking on it now tho, if you have a baton passer that can pass Atk, Def, Sp Def, or Spd, they all help typhlosion survive alot longer for much more sweeping. This set is actually designed to be the head pokemon of a team tho, b/c in standard, typhlosion is very rarely seen (so i hear). opponent sees it, they switch to try to counter it, and it survives long enough to use 2 howls, doubling its attack power. When its about to die, or if you need a kamikaze attack, blitz it out. Even against gyarados, typhlosion can strike hard and fast with thunder punch, and he resists steel. Being that, If played by the strategy above, hes sent out first, theres no time for spikes, stealth rock, or any of the like. as a fire type, he cant be burned either, so no burn atk cuts. the only real way to take this typhlosion is to have a pokemon that can resist electric, fire, and ground well, and that can take a few hits or reduce its atk to cushion a few of the blows.

EDIT: Shell Bell. Just Thought of it, it may sound bad, but if you get off the extra howls, even if you take a bit of damage, you can sweep it all back, literally. they send out gyarados to counter typhlosion, you have normal atk, (howl - Intimidate) thunder punch the gyarados, then it hits typhlosion, then at the end of the turn, you get back an 8th of what you lost from gyarados. the second thunder punch should be enough to finish gyarados off, thus you heal 1/4th of your total HP and possibly have a boosted attack to keep it up with. Also, if you DO take a hit and it brings HP down to the point of triggering Blaze, flare blitz becomes a potential OHKO to even neutral pokemon , and can be used nearly indefinately (with PP limits of course) with shell bell healing every turn.

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  • 2 months later...

i use an offensive suicune (quite rare actually) here it is

suicune

245.png

4 hp

252 sp atk

252 speed

timid

Calm Mind

Hydro Pump

Ice Beam

Hyper Beam

holding leftovers

ability pressure

its a modified version of the one on smogon, heres theirs

[sPRITE]245[/sPRITE]

life orb

Timid/Modest

Calm Mind

Surf/Hydro Pump

Ice Beam

Hidden Power Electric

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i use an offensive suicune (quite rare actually) here it is

suicune

245.png

4 hp

252 sp atk

252 speed

timid

Calm Mind

Hydro Pump

Ice Beam

Hyper Beam

holding leftovers

ability pressure

its a modified version of the one on smogon, heres theirs

[sPRITE]245[/sPRITE]

life orb

Timid/Modest

Calm Mind

Surf/Hydro Pump

Ice Beam

Hidden Power Electric

You literally changed one move, which is NOT AT ALL ORIGINAL or UNIQUE.

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Critical hitter

Absol c/Razor Claw. Super Luck (Critical Hit x2). Jolly. +Spd; -Sp. Atk. 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd

-Psycho Cut: (Psychic) 70/100. Critical stage #2. 20

-Detect: (Fighting) Protect’s user from next attack (stage 3). 5

-Stone Edge: (Rock) 100/ 80. Critical stage #2. 5 / Shadow Claw: (Ghost) 70/100. Critical Stage #2. 15

-Night Slash: (Dark) 70/100. Critical stage #2. 15

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  • 3 weeks later...

I've got a slight variation on the anti-lead Infernape:

Infernape w/ Focus Sash

Jolly

Blaze

252 atk/252 speed/6 HP

- Stealth Rock

- Close Combat

- Flare Blitz

- Encore/Fake Out/Taunt

SR to set up as quickly as possible. Close Combat helps you deal with some other threats + a good STAB.

Flare Blitz is key to this set's success. If you get the chance to attack with your Sash activated, then BLAZE will also be activated. And because you only have ONE HP left, who cares about the recoil?

The last slot is a bit tricky.

Encore lets other leads set up, but you can force them to switch.

Fake Out=duh

Taunt=stops set up.

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  • 1 month later...

Meganium

Support

Relaxed Nature

Item held: Leftovers

Light Screen

Reflect

Synthesis/Leech Seed

Frenzy Plant

6HP/ 252 Def/ 252 Sp. Def

Despite all the stigma choosing chikorita as your starter, Meganium is one of the toughest grass types in the game--possibly tougher than Venusaur. After determining whether or not your opponents movepool is physical and/or special, Meganium can pull out a Light Screen (special) and/or Reflect (Physical) and ward off the strongest Fire, Bug, Poison, Flying and Ice type moves. Meganium also serves as a strong wall against electric, ground, steel, and fighting types. Although Meganium's speed leaves a lot to be desired, investing all of it's EV's in Defense and Special Defense enable Meganium to tough out the first wave of attacks even if they are super effective. Meganium is Generation II's Blastoise.

Empoleon

Special Wall

Quiet Nature

Item held: Leftovers

Flash Cannon/ Aqua Ring

Ice Beam

Air Slash

Hydro Cannon

6HP/ 252 Sp. Att./ 252 Sp. Def

I love Empoleon. It's the only starter that uses Hydro Cannon to it's full potential, since Empoleon has a max Special attack of 353. You may have noticed that I don't like to invest much EV's in HP, which is simply because most battles are determined in the first five turns, and to stall beyond that, even if I am the only using the wall, annoys even me. Empoleon is pretty persevering and has a lot of resistances. With an Aqua Ring and Leftovers combination, it's pretty tough to bring down Empoleon's HP even if you didn't max out it's EV's. Like Meganium, Empoleon can tough out the first wave of attacks, and with a maxed out Special Attack, Empoleon becomes an almost unstoppable force. Empoleon is great! Though, Blastoise is still my favorite water type starter.

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Moves with the same effect as Hyper Beam almost always tend to suck, and should not be used. They hit hard, but allow someone to set up while your Pokemon is immobilized, which can mean losing the game.

If you're using anything with Reflect and Light Screen(these moves together are labeled as Dual Screen), I strongly recommend that you use Light Clay as an item. Light Clay increases the turns that the screens are up from 5 to 8.

Meganium likes Reflect, Light Screen, Synthesis and Aromatherapy. Aromatherapy fits in perfectly as most Dual Screen teams are offensively used, and often status weak.

You have no reason to use Relaxed, as it's not using a mixed attack set. Jolly, Timid, Bold, Calm, Careful, or Impish on the set I recommended.

Also, Empoleon doesn't learn Air Slash. Hydro Cannon and Flash Cannon suck on it. Use Surf and Grass Knot instead. Use Modest on it,unless you're using it with Trick Room.

It's also not a special wall, just has high Hp and Special Defense. A special wall set has Calm with Surf, Stealth Rock/Roar/Yawn, Ice Beam/Grass knot, and Roar/Yawn.

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Moves with the same effect as Hyper Beam almost always tend to suck, and should not be used. They hit hard, but allow someone to set up while your Pokemon is immobilized, which can mean losing the game.

If you're using anything with Reflect and Light Screen(these moves together are labeled as Dual Screen), I strongly recommend that you use Light Clay as an item. Light Clay increases the turns that the screens are up from 5 to 8.

Meganium likes Reflect, Light Screen, Synthesis and Aromatherapy. Aromatherapy fits in perfectly as most Dual Screen teams are offensively used, and often status weak.

You have no reason to use Relaxed, as it's not using a mixed attack set. Jolly, Timid, Bold, Calm, Careful, or Impish on the set I recommended.

Also, Empoleon doesn't learn Air Slash. Hydro Cannon and Flash Cannon suck on it. Use Surf and Grass Knot instead. Use Modest on it,unless you're using it with Trick Room.

It's also not a special wall, just has high Hp and Special Defense. A special wall set has Calm with Surf, Stealth Rock/Roar/Yawn, Ice Beam/Grass knot, and Roar/Yawn.

I don't disagree that Aromatherapy is a good move for Meganium, I just find it as a space filler most of the time. And I disagree with you when it comes to the elemental hyper beams. Yes, they're not as consistent as Surf, Energy Ball or Flamethrower, but they certainly pack the punch when you need it; and for Meganium, since it's Special Attack could be better, Frenzy Plant suffices. I will consider adding Light Clay as it does seem useful for Dual Screen combinations, though that is not to say Leftovers isn't a good item to use either. As for the Natures, I did consider a Calm Nature, and on a whim chose Relaxed--as I find nothing wrong with Calm and Bold Natures. On the other hand, Jolly, Timid, Careful and Impish natures are debatable.

When it comes to Empoleon, I firmly disagree. To this date, I have not lost a single competitive battle (WIFI battles, Battle Tower, Pokemon League, you name it) using Empoleon in the capacity I mentioined above and I've been using Empoleon since Diamond. I doubt that all my opponents were just simply incompetent. When it comes to Fighting, Electric, and Ground Types, their special defenses are relative low or not enough to withstand even a simple Flash Cannon from Empoleon. The only fighting types with great Special Defenses are the Hitmon-three, Heracross, and maybe Poliwrath. And by the way Flash Cannon is great, it unexpectedly covers a lot of bases like grass, rock, ice, electric, and dark, at least when I've used it. Hydro Cannon is awesome with Empoleon. Yes Surf would be more consistent, but I urge you to try Hydro Cannon with an Empoleon whose Special Attack is maxed out--grass, electric, ice, and some water types don't stand a chance. Yeah, you'd have to wait a full turn before being able to use it again--which is why I also max it's special defense and with it's type combination it has many resistances and the aqua-ring leftover combination recovers HP pretty quickly--but it's awe striking when watching your opponents HP go down to zero without fail. I don't mind a modest nature, though I don't find Empoleon's speed to very important which is why natures such as Quiet natures don't bother me either.

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I just find it as a space filler most of the time.

Try saying that when your team keeps getting hit with status. ONE use of that move can heal ALL status of your entire team.

And I disagree with you when it comes to the elemental hyper beams. Yes, they're not as consistent as Surf, Energy Ball or Flamethrower, but they certainly pack the punch when you need it;

You'll never get a chance to use it.

You'll die soon after because your opponent sets up on you.

[qiuote]When it comes to Empoleon, I firmly disagree. To this date, I have not lost a single competitive battle (WIFI battles, Battle Tower, Pokemon League, you name it) using Empoleon in the capacity I mentioined above and I've been using Empoleon since Diamond. I doubt that all my opponents were just simply incompetent.

They are. I also don't believe you made it too far in the Battle Tower.

[qiuote] but I urge you to try Hydro Cannon with an Empoleon whose Special Attack is maxed out--grass, electric, ice, and some water types don't stand a chance.

Blissey and Vaporeon would laugh in your face.

I'll say this once again. This is for original sets. If your set sucks (And you were told quite kindly, might I add), take the criticism and make changes. Don't want to change it? Don't post for your Pokemon set to be rated then.

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Try saying that when your team keeps getting hit with status. ONE use of that move can heal ALL status of your entire team.

I never denied Aromatherapy being a good move for Meganium--I said that earlier. From my experience battling with Meganium, I find it to be a space filler. There's no need for sarcasm.

You'll never get a chance to use it.

You'll die soon after because your opponent sets up on you.

But I have! Many times to be frank. Don't get me wrong, they're not 100% accurate and you have your occasional misses, but they've been consistent enough for me.

They are. I also don't believe you made it too far in the Battle Tower.

I got a 100-win streak in the battle tower in singles and doubles, which doesn't always include Empoleon--I've beaten Palmer so many times. However, everytime I've used Empoleon, I've never lost. But, dude, I don't care if you don't believe me. Am I supposed to feel invalidated because you don't believe what I say is true. Am I to suggest sending you my Diamond/Heart Gold game card just to prove I'm right?! Loosen up!

Blissey and Vaporeon would laugh in your face.

I don't remember mentioning normal types like Blissey and I said "SOME" water types. I know Blissey is an annoying behemoth and I would never use Empoleon to battle it. Instead I would use Alakazam with 252 EV towards its Special and 252 EV towards its speed and equip it with the expert belt and use Focus Blast. I'm sorry If I didn't assume that Empoleon would fight every freaking Pokemon out there. But next time, I'll make that clear to you.

I'll say this once again. This is for original sets. If your set sucks (And you were told quite kindly, might I add), take the criticism and make changes. Don't want to change it? Don't post for your Pokemon set to be rated then.

Settle down, guy. Did you even read my post. There are some things I was willing to consider when it came to Meganium, like the using the light clay and even Empoleon concerning the modest nature. But I bet your head was so far up this cloud of grandeur you built for yourself, that any move set that you haven't poached from serebii.net, makes your nipples flare in anger. Dude this is a POKEMON game to say the least. I like it, don't get me wrong. But there's no reason to take it so seriously. And when did it become a rule of thumb to accept criticism from one person?!

You don't even know me, or how long I've been playing this game (I'll give you a hint, I still have the copy of the Blue version I bought when it first was released in America). And you assume that I can't accept constructive criticism because I disagreed with ONE POST! I'm sorry if I don't respond well to douchebags. If you want to to talk to me then talk to me, don't patronize me. If you feel like I'm a waste of time, then don't bother with me, especially dealing snide remarks that aren't well veiled.

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I never denied Aromatherapy being a good move for Meganium--I said that earlier. From my experience battling with Meganium, I find it to be a space filler. There's no need for sarcasm.

It wasn't sarcasm.

But I have! Many times to be frank. Don't get me wrong, they're not 100% accurate and you have your occasional misses, but they've been consistent enough for me.

Any number of Pokemon will gladly come in and set up on you. Some Gyarados and Salamence sets only need one Dragon Dance before they become almost unstoppable. One Swords Dance from Lucario also. And because you used a Hyper Beam move, you can't do anything.

I don't remember mentioning normal types like Blissey and I said "SOME" water types. I know Blissey is an annoying behemoth and I would never use Empoleon to battle it. Instead I would use Alakazam with 252 EV towards its Special and 252 EV towards its speed and equip it with the expert belt and use Focus Blast. I'm sorry If I didn't assume that Empoleon would fight every freaking Pokemon out there. But next time, I'll make that clear to you.

Alakazam is an absolutely horrible counter to Blissey.

I'd respond to the rest of your post, but it's just flame bait. If you think anybody goes to Serebii for movesets, you have no idea what you're talking about. If you can't handle criticism without lashing out, feel free to not post.

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Any number of Pokemon will gladly come in and set up on you. Some Gyarados and Salamence sets only need one Dragon Dance before they become almost unstoppable. One Swords Dance from Lucario also. And because you used a Hyper Beam move, you can't do anything.

I never denied that possibility. Somehow you assume that just because I like using those moves, I'm oblivious to it's draw backs. Despite know that, I still like them and don't believe them to be ineffectual. I disagreed, I didn't dismiss.

Alakazam is an absolutely horrible counter to Blissey.

Not necessarily. Their max Special Attack and Special Defense respectively are the same. I tend to use the expert belt with Alakazam mostly, but I use the choice specs too. I've seen a Blissey go down, first hand, to 2 focus blasts by my Alakazam with the choice specs--granted it was a double battle and I had a Clefable with Helping Hand and Follow Me.

I'd respond to the rest of your post, but it's just flame bait. If you think anybody goes to Serebii for movesets, you have no idea what you're talking about. If you can't handle criticism without lashing out, feel free to not post.

Dude, I can handle criticism. Again, this is a Pokemon game, I'm not going to get put off if you criticize the pokemon I use or the movesets I chose for them. You simply offended me--you're kind of rude. And most of the movesets I've seen in this thread come are similar if not the same as the ones I see on Serebii.net's 4th Generation Pokemon of the Week. I've used their movesets in the past and found them to be boring. Like I said in my previous post, I don't like battles that last very long, even I'm the one use the behemoth. Forgive if I don't mind the thrill of knowing whether or not my pokemon can win a battle with just 2 HP--I find it to be much more fun that way.

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Not necessarily. Their max Special Attack and Special Defense respectively are the same. I tend to use the expert belt with Alakazam mostly, but I use the choice specs too. I've seen a Blissey go down, first hand, to 2 focus blasts by my Alakazam with the choice specs--granted it was a double battle and I had a Clefable with Helping Hand and Follow Me.

Blissey has massive HP, can heal itself with Wish or Softboiled, can Thunder Wave/Toxic Alakazam (and can recover status from Synchronize with Natural Cure or Aromatherapy), while Alakzam can do what...sometimes hit with Focus Blast? If someone with Blissey really wanted to, it'd just end up in PP stall. Either you faced a poorly trained Blissey or you got real lucky in being able to do all that set up.

Double Battles are different, and if that's your preferred playing style, you should mention that. All rates here are assuming single battle unless otherwise noted.

you're kind of rude.

I'm blunt, not rude. If you can't handle a bit of bluntness, then feel free to not respond to my posts. YOU threw insults and called names. I did no such thing.

And most of the movesets I've seen in this thread come are similar if not the same as the ones I see on Serebii.net's 4th Generation Pokemon of the Week.

And your point? Serebii is a Pokemon web site focused on games and to a lesser extent, the anime. They have one competitive feature that runs once a week. The guy who writes it chooses one move, usually a standard set, because that article is aimed to be read by competitive and non competitive players alike. So that anyone can understand what this Pokemon can and cannot do, what they're the best at, in a competitive battle.

Even so, just because Serebii's feature has a set doesn't invalidate it. Just because you find sets "boring" doesn't make them bad. And just because you don't like battles that last "long" doesn't make all Pokemon who are walls bad Pokemon. In fact, it can put you at a disadvantage because it probably means Pokemon like Blissey and Skarmory can wall your teams to no end.

And yes, some sets look similar to pretty standard sets. They probably shouldn't have been posted here. But just because standard sets shouldn't be posted doesn't mean anything should be posted.

Either way, this mini-discussion ends now. If you want to start a thread on this subject of double battles or how Alakazam can take out Blissey or whatever, please do so.

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Rate my Alakazam

Mild/Modest/Timid Nature

Special Sweeper

252 EV Sp. Attack/ 252 EV Spd.

Items Held: Choice Specs/ Expert Belt

Moveset:

Focus Blast

Psychic

Shadow Ball

Calm Mind/ Hidden Power (fire)

I'm not trying to be sarcastic, I really want to know what you guys think.

It can work... Psychic is scary but to guard yourself against stuff like sucker Punch or successfully set up Calm Minds, try running Substitute someplace. Shadow Ball + Focus Blast already gives an unparalleled coverage, so removing Psychic can actually be a logical thing here.

Oh and another thing. Don't run Choice Specs if you're using Calm Mind. And the EV spread can be adjusted to be slightly more specially defensive...

I don't know if it constitutes as unique though because so many sets are like that one.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Rate my hack Ninetales (it's legit)

Ninetales

Name:Ninetales

Type:Ghost

Level:100

Nature:Naive

Shiny:Yes looks more ghost that way

Ability:Illuminate

Moves:

Hypnosis

Dream Eater

Shadow Claw

Night Shade

This is not my strongest pokemon but its my favorite

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  • 2 months later...

I used to run this Swampert set many times during the RSE&FR/LG days, including NetBattle; it worked very well for me back in the day, but I'm not sure how it would fare nowadays (what with Stealth Rock and its ilk). It is a set I greatly enjoyed using at the time, so just for fun I decided to post it after coming across this thread...

Swampert @ Leftovers

Ability: Torrent (Not that it matters, really...)

Nature: Careful

Ev Spread: 252 HP / 214 Sp. Def / Def 40 / Atk 4

Moveset:

- Curse

- Earthquake

- Brick Break

- Mirror Coat

I went through the arduous task of breeding for this to have 31 IVs in HP, Attack, Defense, and Special Defense, not sure what the IVs were on the rest, but not that it actually matters. Sometimes I would run this as lead, other times I would switch it on an Electric attack or against something that Swampert would resit and move from there, but most of the time I would use it once I eliminated at least two of my opponent's PKMN. I still remember one time where I led with it and managed to pull 4 Curses, my opponent apparently hoping for a critical (I would assume), but after the fourth Curse he switched to an Alakazam, launching a Psychic only to be returned doubly. Good times. I had a blast using this set!

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Swampert @ Leftovers

Ability: Torrent (Not that it matters, really...)

Nature: Careful

Ev Spread: 252 HP / 214 Sp. Def / Def 40 / Atk 4

Moveset:

- Curse

- Earthquake

- Brick Break

- Mirror Coat

It looks like it could make for a good surprise lead so long as you get passed the taunt/rockers such as aero, azelf etc. It also looks like it could do very well late game with the right support.

Problem is a lot of guys run HP grass souly for the bulky waters, then there's always infernape and a ton of other special/mixed sweepers with grassknot. Which isn't (as far as I'm aware) wasn't present in gen III. On paper it looks viable in the current meta game but at a deeper look probably best left to the 3rd gen. So, yeah so long as you can get passed the sweepers and grassers I imagine this could tear up late game. Rest could be a possibility over mirror coat with a chesto berry (I think).

Cool set though :P

On another note:

I don't think I've posted this before. This is a UU lead that worked great for me for quite a long time, anyone wanna rate it :D.

[HGSSSPRITE]283[/HGSSSPRITE]

Panique (Gardevoir) (F) @ Choice Scarf

Ability: Trace

EVs: 56 HP/252 Spd/200 SDef

Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)

- Hypnosis

- Healing Wish

- Psychic

- Trick

The idea is to trickscarf set up/BP leads, or just leads that are more of the anti lead nature. Hypnosis is for later on in the game, or the switch in after trick, psychic is for froslass (who gets KO'd before it can spike if it taunts first). Healing wish is to give a sweeper another chance later on in game. A really disruptive, multi purpose lead :).

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Yeah, seems like a segregated moveset; and I have indeed read and seen how many prepare for Bulky Waters. Thinking about it, could Swampert handle an HP Grass? Back then it was considered physical, but now it's wholly different. I'm positive a Grass Knot would certainly end its run for sure. But it might still have its uses--late game seems viable, as you stated.

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