Sandstorm Team, MLG

[Chaos]

This team is designed for competative Wi-Fi via MLG. Please rate, comment, and give addvise to this team.

Aerodacty @ Focus Sash

Nature: Jolly

Ability: Pressure

Evs: Hp 4 Atk 252 Spe 252

Role: Lead

Taunt

Stealth Rocks

Rock Slide

Earthquake

Before anyone reminds me, yes i do know i have rock slide over stone edge. I prefer the greater accuracy and the possibilty of a flinch that rock slide brings to the table. Other than that though its a standard Taunt + Stealth Rocks Aerodactyl. Just Taunt Stealth and then fight till she faints. (Bulky mance, drogonite, and other bulky flyings are giving trouble. rockslide takes down the offencive sweepers but has trouble on defencive bulky flyings. would stone edge be better? even if riskier?)

Tyranitar @ leftovers

Nature: Bold

Ability: Sandstream

Evs: Hp 252 Atk 52 Spe 30 SpAtk176

Role: Sandstormer / Sub + Counter

Substitute

Crunch

Focus Punch

Flame Thrower

She is my sandstorm setter and also a good wall. This new and improved ttar is now helping me deal some damage and weaken the opponent. Hippopowdon did her job of toxic and roar but it just didn't fit as well with the team

Metagross @ Expert Belt

Nature: Naive

Ability: Clearbody

Evs: Atk 252 Spe 134 SpAtk 124

Role: Wall Breaker

Meteor Mash

Thunder Punch

Hidden Power (Fire)

Grass Knot

Metagross mainly goes up against Bulky Waters and other Steal Types that may try and get in my way. Thunder Punch is in there for gyarados and flying dragons like mence and dragonite.(currently having trouble with magnezones. should i move more into SpAtk?)

Empoleon @ Petaya Berry

Nature: Modest

Ability: Torrent

Evs: Hp 12 Def 12 SpAtk 252 SpDef 234

Role: Late Game Sweeper / Dragon Counter

Agility

Substitute

Surf

IceBeam

Standart SubPetaya Empoleon. Substitute and Agility untill Petaya Berry is used. Then with Petaya and torrent boost procceed to sweep.

Gliscore @ Leftovers

Nature: Impish

Ability: Hypercutter

Evs: Hp 252 Atk 40 Spe 216

Role: Tank

Sword Dance

Roost

Rock Slide

Earthquake

Dance roost and sweep, simple as that. Vaporeon just wasn't working out. Metagross was handeling waters (even gyarados) just fine; and i was missing my flying friend against some of those electrics and steels.

Lucario @ Life Orb

Nature: Adamant

Ability: Inner Focus

Evs: Atk 252 Def 4 Spe 252

Role: Revenge Killer / Late Game Sweeper

Sword Dance

Close Combat

Extreme Speed

Fire Punch

Lucario is my revenge killer and late game sweeper. Extreme speed is my revenge kill move. Sword dance and close combat to sweep late game. Steels were becoming a problem so fire punch was added. (This has been esential as a scizor counter)

The BOLD is the most recent changes made.

Edited June 23, 2009 by Chaos
team update

[GGfan]

Hello Chaos,

actually the fact that you have Tyrannitar in your team doesn´t make it a sandstorm team.

Few pokemon in your team benefit from it, but ok.

Aerodactyl isn´t a good lead in dpp, if you take a look at the top leads list you will see why, common leads are azelf, Infernape, heatran, metagross.

Only two of them, Heatran and zelf that lacks psychic, can´t do anything to aerodactly if you use taunt to stop their attempts to set up sr. Metagross will 2hko you with bulletpunch and set up sr after your dead and explode on another mon, infernape will use fake out and cc and will still have its sash when it sets up sr.

Azelf without psychic and heatran won´t do anything to you but it isn´t worth it. Anyway none of your team members is weak to sr, why would you need a fast taunter?

I suggest a Swampert, with the following set,Sr, EQ, Protect, Ice beam

thi swill allow you to gain an advantage over all the other leads, protect is needed to survive explosion since eq can´t ohko metagross.

The next thing is, your are incredibly weak to ground atm, for example a gyarados with eq can ko all of your team members, gyarados will give you a hard day anyway since metagross can´t really hurt it, same for empoleon.

To fix your ground weakness I suggest you make gliscor more defensive, it will be your lucario check too and replace empoleon or metagross. I think you should keep metagross I really like it.

If you make tyrannitar a cb pursuiter to get rid of rotom and celebi, metagross can beat stall with relative ease. Therefore use thunderpunch(for gyarados), hp fire, mm, grass knot.

As I said, said Tyrannitar is quite ineffective atm, make it cb, with the following set:crunch pursuit se aquatail

the next thing we have to do is find a check to mixedmence and gyarados which can give your team a very hard time respectively.

I rarely suggest this, but I think a Vaporeon would fit very well to your team. I fyou predict well it can stall mixed mence with wish protect, and it will be a reliable gyarados check. I suggest the standard vaporeon 252hp/252def bold, surf wish protect hp electric. Also it can heal ttar when it got hurt by rotom or celebi enabling it to take on another pursuit victim.

Furthemore, you could make your gliscore defensive to survive a +1 waterfall.

I suggest you use eq, roost thunderfang and taunt. thunderfang to revenge gyarados if you let vaporeon die.

Good luck

[wraith89]

GGFan, this is in real life though. If Hidden Power is not the right type, what other move can you suggest for Vaporeon?

[Chaos]

I can get any hidden power so its fine to recomend any hidden power

[GGfan]

GGFan, this is in real life though. If Hidden Power is not the right type, what other move can you suggest for Vaporeon?

You can get Hidden Power in DS, too.I am trying to make the team perfect.

[wraith89]

You can get Hidden Power in DS, too.I am trying to make the team perfect.

Yes, you can. But you cannot easily modify a Hidden Power's type and power. So if it isn't HP Electric, what else can you suggest him?

[Chaos]

i am using pokesav and other aquired tools so please feel free to make any recomendations

[wraith89]

Ah, I see. Then HP Electric would suffice. However, try to not make it blatant by having near perfect IVs (like a certain someone with a HP Electric Vaporeon >.>) and PIDs would matter.

If you don't want HP Electric, perhaps Ice Beam will do, although Vaporeon is in no business fighting dragons and whatnot.

[GGfan]

well, Vapo can´t pose gyarados any troubles with ice beam, it really needs hp electric.

If chaos thinks he can get it, it will be a good addition to the team

[Illithian]

Just a small point, sub petaya never really works because of the omnipresence of priority moves such as bullet punch, ice shard, vacuum wave, mach punch, aqua jet, extremespeed, quick attack, etc.

[Milo]

Just a small point, sub petaya never really works because of the omnipresence of priority moves such as bullet punch, ice shard, vacuum wave, mach punch, aqua jet, extremespeed, quick attack, etc.

it actually does work pretty well. bolded moves are resisted by empoleon (who is quite bulky in his own right), and the others aren't exactly common. besides, you should have flushed them out sooner if you're expecting empoleon to sweep.

[Illithian]

it actually does work pretty well. bolded moves are resisted by empoleon (who is quite bulky in his own right), and the others aren't exactly common. besides, you should have flushed them out sooner if you're expecting empoleon to sweep.

Actually, that is true. Lategame, Empoleon can be a beast.

[pokemonfan]

I hope this is good...I'm not sure but I think it would work. I only wanted to comment on the first two.

Your lead, areodactyl I believe can be used differently.

Like so

Areodactly @ leftovers

Nature: Jolly (That’s for speed)

Ability: Pressure

Evs: Concentrated in defense and special defense

Role: Wall lead

Moveset:

Stealth rocks

Whirlwind

Roost

Substitute

Comment:

The first move you should is substitute then follow up with roost. Then you can set up stealth rocks and just blow through the team with whirlwind so that they’ll keep getting hurt by the rocks. With the substitute guarding you and then you can heal up with roost whenever you get to low, plus you have leftovers to help you stay in the game you can successfully do damage to all of your opponents pokemon making it easier for them to be defeated by the rest of your team. Plus if anyone manages to outspeed you with the pressure ability the PP of the move they used will be reduced. Hopefully with a high enough defense stat you’ll be able to hold off most of the attacks.

Tyranitar @ leftovers

Nature: careful

Ability: Sandstream

Evs: concentrated in defense and special defense

Role: Sandstormer / Wall / Scout

Sustitute

Curse

Crunch

Roar

Comment: It can be more then a sandstreamer. Hopefully it will have high defensive stats already and then when it gets in after areodactyl it can start up with substitute and then curse its way up to a physical wall. Then it can also sweep with crunch but it wont have any speed. Assuming that the stealth rocks are still there and that they haven’t been countered by a spinner you could roar through the team again.

If you do post something like this again...use images...it makes it far more fun to read

[wraith89]

For Aero, Taunt lead is better. Not only is Aero the fastest Taunt lead there is for OU but he was really meant to get one thing done: lay Stealth Rocks. That's all he's there to do. He isn't meant for phazing much... because he's so frail. Although phazing stuff like lead Metagross CAN help... it's usually not played that way. Aero's a suicide lead, and that's all he's meant to do.

As for Tyranitar, that thing will get easily walled by the vast Fighting types in this game. When will he ever get time to set up? It looks nice and all, but too many things threaten him. And as for phazing, he's TOO slow to outphaze a Skarmory who would Whirlwind you out first after all those curses. Even with + 6, I'll get Crunch will fail to OHKO Skarmory.

[pokemonfan]

You do know that was just a suggestion but at least I didn't remove the stealth rocks of of aerodactyl. I guess there is the whole fighting strike from a fast and powerful fighting type will destroy tyranitar but if he survives the hit he can KO it with crunch and then try to recover with leftovers or try and roar through the team some more to hurt them on the stealth rocks. At least I made an attempt wraith89, how exactly would taunt help areodactyl?

[wraith89]

. . .

Don't take what I say offensively >.>

I'm merely correcting. And Taunt helps because most leads tend to use something like Stealth Rocks or a status move... and Aerodactyl prevents that from happening. Then he can set up Rocks and do what he pleases.

[pokemonfan]

True so then maybe something like

Taunt

Stealth rock

Whirlwind

Roost (when needed)

Would that be better?

Also I did notice that tyranitar has a lot of weaknesses and it might be better just to remove him entirely and put in someone else that can do the job better.

[wraith89]

That guy's Taunt bait :-/

If something with a Scarf with Taunt comes in (not going to happen, but...)

Aero wants to do something though... and no, Roost is pointless. If you're going that route, use Rock Slide instead.

Tyranitar dies to everything... even with 100/110/100 Defenses (with sandstream boost)... but he's actually very useful believe it or not.

[pokemonfan]

That is quite odd.

Wraith89 EDIT: Contribute... don't make useless posts please

[Chaos]

Latest update includes...

Vaporeon is in for Gliscor now (thanks for the advice)

Hippowdon is in for ttar because ttar didn't do very much for me except setup a storm

Fire punch in for ice punch on lucario because steels were a problem

[Enkidu]

Tyranitar dies to everything... even with 100/110/100 Defenses (with sandstream boost)... but he's actually very useful believe it or not.

How does he... Tyranitar is able to live through alot, A celebi's grassknot isn't a OHKO on tyranitar, Gengar's FOCUS BLAST has only a chance of a OHKO on tyranitar ( assuming tyranitar has a defensive spread, and if you run a defensive enough one it never OHKO's, even with Stealth rocks ) So lets see, 130 base special attack, 150 base power move, 400% weakness to it and he can STILL live through it? He only dies to everything if you aren't using him properly.

Stealth rocks

Whirlwind

Roost

Substitute

Thats a sub roost set, it's only useful Mid-late game when a sandstorm is up and Spikes/SR and maybe toxic spikes are on the field. Since he's so fast no other phazer can taunt him out.

As for Tyranitar, that thing will get easily walled by the vast Fighting types in this game. When will he ever get time to set up? It looks nice and all, but too many things threaten him. And as for phazing, he's TOO slow to outphaze a Skarmory who would Whirlwind you out first after all those curses. Even with + 6, I'll bet Crunch will fail to OHKO Skarmory.

What? The entire point of a curse set first off, it to make sure all of the phazers/counters to it are gone first ( which there really are few of ) . The curse set is not a stand alone pokemon, but when used it is the strategy that the entire team is built around. The CB pursuit and dragon dancer is put into teams to counter specific threats and in some cases render entire pokemon useless.

As far as being phazed out goes, Tyranitar is a pokemon that NEEDS to be set up for a specific goal. "Set up" when you use it Only refers to the curse or Dragon dance sets, but his CB pursuit set is by far his most used one, Boah is an amazing wall breaker since after a substitute Focus punch will almost One shot a majority of the fighting types out there ( because they take neutral from fighting ) or let him rip through stall teams and a Dragon dance set with flamethrower as the final move lets you beat common switch ins like Skarmory and Scizor, even with no EV investment and then proceed to wipe out an opponents entire team, there main Tyranitar counter gone. Even things like Salamence and Gyarados that have intimidate and are bulky fear +0 Stone edge from tyranitar as it can One shot both of them.

The majority of pokemon, even with super effective hits that can't kill Tyranitar is astounding . Also something like tyranitar can set up on so many pokemon, that saying he never has time to set up is just dead wrong.

If thats Tl;dr Hippowdon for a more defensive oriented team, while Tyranitar fits on a more offense oriented one.

[wraith89]

How does he... Tyranitar is able to live through alot, A celebi's grassknot isn't a OHKO on tyranitar, Gengar's FOCUS BLAST has only a chance of a OHKO on tyranitar ( assuming tyranitar has a defensive spread, and if you run a defensive enough one it never OHKO's, even with Stealth rocks ) So lets see, 130 base special attack, 150 base power move, 400% weakness to it and he can STILL live through it? He only dies to everything if you aren't using him properly.

And you're saying I'm not using it properly X_X

Fine then (stupid crits). Even if it isn't an OHKO, Tyranitar doesn't do enough damage to justify the damage it takes back. Defensive sets leave very little room for attack EVs (although he generally doesn't need much if he has a method of boosting his attack). One of the best sets I've seen was the Cursetar with Resttalk and Payback. I don't care what refutation you have, but Dragon Dance Tyranitar blows. I'd leave Dragon Dancing off to stuff like Salamence or Dragonite or even Gyarados... Tyranitar's a bit too slow to pull that off.

What? The entire point of a curse set first off, it to make sure all of the phazers/counters to it are gone first ( which there really are few of ) . The curse set is not a stand alone pokemon, but when used it is the strategy that the entire team is built around. The CB pursuit and dragon dancer is put into teams to counter specific threats and in some cases render entire pokemon useless.

Easier said than done. X_X

[Enkidu]

One of the best sets I've seen was the Cursetar with Resttalk and Payback. I don't care what refutation you have, but Dragon Dance Tyranitar blows. I'd leave Dragon Dancing off to stuff like Salamence or Dragonite or even Gyarados... Tyranitar's a bit too slow to pull that off.

First off, Gyarados and Salamence serve 2 very different purposes and both do their respective dragon dance sets incredibly well. Dragonite, regardless of what YOU say is a worthless dragon dancer and is inferior to salamence in every way when running a dragon dancing set. He shines as a mixed sweeper however as he gets access to Superpower and thunderbolt, along with draco meteor, roost, outrage and earthquake.

1: If anything one of the "best" sets would be the Mixed dragon dancer set where DD is only used to really boost speed as things like Salamence/Gyarados are both taken out by Ice beam and thunderbolt while Crunch/Stone edge rounds out your coverage and provides a nice attack to use with his boosted attack. This prevents Skarmory from "walling" you, prevents gyarados and salamence from countering you as after 1 DD you outspeed them and Thunderbolt/Icebeam rape both of them, lets you take on the likes of starmie and vaporeon who try to switch in and counter you, dragonite,gliscor and Flygon are all taken out relatively easy with icebeam as you outspeed all of them ( bar choice scarf variants ) and OHKO them. Having one physical move means blissey's that switch in cannot stop this guy either effectively giving you a wall breaker that opens up sweeps for the rest of your team OR in the event of fighting a poorly designed team will let you sweep with tyranitar unimpeded.

The curse set is less useful because with a 400% weakness to a common attacking type and a speed drop, it means all the opponent has to do is switch in something faster with a STAB fighting attack ( or simply high attack ) and Tyranitar is either dead, or forced to switch out. ( Lucario/Hitmonlee/Infernape/Staraptor/Gallade/Medicham/blaziken/heracross/machamp )

Edited June 13, 2009 by wraith89
Edited out the swearing

[wraith89]

If it's only there to boost speed, why not use Rock Polish/LO combo instead?

Dragonite CAN actually use Dragon Dance thanks to his plethora of support moves. Light Screen/Roost/DD/Outrage Lum Berry Dragonite has served me wonders as a late game sweeper. But yes, I see your point. Salamence was designed more to be a sweeper than Dragonite was... but I'm not letting that orange Barney with the insane movepool go into waste. And never use Jolly Dragonite... it only makes him an inferior Salamence X_X

Easier said than done, but you can make a whole team to eliminate counters to Cursetar and let Cursetar do the honors in the end. I've seen it done before... but at another time, Cursetar was a dead weight... always forced to switch out against a team of Lucario/Infernape/Breloom/Machamp (why 4 fighters?) X_X

[Enkidu]

Because the majority of teams do run Gyarados/Salamence and Dragon dance gives +1 attack/+1 speed, meaning a Gyarados or salamence can switch in and not lower his attack to -1 but =0 Instead. This means tyranitar can still pose a threat with his physical attacks as if he is not intimidated his attack, even with small to no investment, is greater than it would be with 252 attack and adamant at +1.