Snorlax Moveset

[j2k15]

Hi,

I just have caught Snorlax. It has Sassy nature which decreases speed and increases Sp. Def.

I want to use it to play against my friends.

I'm thinking of this moveset :

- Rest

- Body slam

- Crunch or Fire Punch

- Recycle

Item would be Chesto Berry.

EV HP : 140

EV Sp Def : 252

EV Att : 116

Rest + Chesto + Recycle = no comment needed

Body Slam : high accuracy, STAB, 30% chance paralysis

Between Fire Punch and Crunch, it's hard to decide.

As I want to make it a Sp Sponge, Crunch would be ideal for Sp sweepers like Gengar or Alakazam.

But this Snorlax would be weak against Steel.

On the other hand, Fire Punch could also be good against Gengar. Snorlax has high physical attack and Gengar low physical defense.

Alakazam can still be hit with Body Slam.

So my preference would be to use Fire Punch over Crunch.

Does this set make sense ?

[wraith89]

Your set is fine, but I do not really like wasting one turn to recycle Chesto Berry because it gives the opponent ample time to catch on to what you are doing and will use that turn to take advantage. I would usually just place Sleep Talk there, but that is also RNG dependent and it can also potentially be a waste of turn too. Just something to think about there.

I'm guessing Fire Punch is mainly for the likes of Skarmory or Scizor, when Earthquake can usually hit Steel Pokemon harder. That's fine. Or maybe that TM26 is too valuable to use on Snorlax I suppose. Body Slam hits Alakazam and the rest no problem. For Gengar, Fire Punch hits okay, but it is a dicey battle against Gengar because it can use strange things, if your friend is clever enough. What I would be concerned about is having a proper team that can cover each other in the case you hit a stumbling block. Do not expect Snorlax to be your win condition, because it still needs big threats like Fighters, Rhydons and Ghosts taken care of.

[j2k15]

Many thanks for this detailed answer.

As said, I plan to use this Snorlax as a Sp. absorber.

Sleep Talk, I hesitated but I don't like the fact it'll miss 1/3 of the time or 2/3 against ghosts.

Recycle would be used only in case of necessity. I hope to not have to rest more than 1 time.

But what I like with Recycle, Rest and Chesto is that my opponents might use a lot of PP of their powerful attacks. Imagine then if Snorlax could have the "Pressure" ability. :-)

Also, it'd be too nice for a Gengar with Dream Eater to face a sleeping Snorlax.

Indeed I'm vulnerable against something like Rhydon / Golem / ...

A strong physical and accurate water attack would be really nice. Too bad Surf is a special attack.

One of my friend uses Gengar for sure. And Earthquake will not touch it since it levitates.

Against Fighting types, I'll be hard also.

So after all this thinking I understand better your point of getting rid of Recycle to increase coverage with another strong physical attack move.

I'll check the alternatives to Earthquake and then decide if I make it more versatile or if I keep it as a PP Sp. Attacks absorber because for sure he won't win the game alone. So maybe better to keep it for its purpose and build a team around him to cover each other.

About facing a Gengar, the risk would be my friends giving him the strong Fighting Special Attack (don't remember the name). But it shall not OHKO me I think giving Snorlax huge HP and Sp Def and the fact that this attack will not be stabbed.

I've not said it but we'll be mostly playing singles standard (3 vs 3) "flat" battles.

The other I'll train for sure those battles are :

- Exeggutor

- Gengar

- Ditto

- Primeape

- Aerodactyl

- Dugtrio

The ones I might train after :

- Moltres

- Articuno (mind reader + sheer cold)

- Dodrio : just because my Duduo is (except Gyarados) the only Shiny I caught

- Electrode

I'll just take Pokemon I like.

I think with this list I can make some combinations of 3 Pokemons teams.

Thanks again !

[wraith89]

I am not sure about the skill levels of your friends but Dream Eater is seldomly used in battles for one very reason: Pokemon switch often. Even in 3v3, it is too situational. That also applies to your Articuno: Mind reader + Sheer Cold is only good if you can trap the opponent Pokemon before even attempting it, and assuming Articuno survives one hit before firing it (it is usually bulky enough, but some things hit it too hard). It can be a win condition as a last Pokemon or something though, if you time it right. But generally I would advise against those.

Back in the old days some Snorlax carried Surf just for Rhydon/Golem. I think they are weak enough for a OHKO or 2HKO from it. If you tried breeding some Pokemon, they can get some nifty egg moves to help out. Unless Ditto is one of your favourite mons or something, I am going to say it is very hard to use Ditto in this game. One whole turn is costly to try and transforming. If you have Pokemon Black/White (2) with Hidden Ability Ditto it is a different story, but currently I would advise against it. Your Dugtrio, if it has Arena Trap, will serve you very well provided you know when and where to use it. If you see your friend with a very susceptible mon to Dugtrio's trapping, you'll know when to employ its service. I only had a very cursory look on the Pokemon you plan on bringing, but some of it seems okay. 3v3 is very fast paced, so there is little time for stalling, which also means Recycle is a bit hard to use. Maybe a Lum Berry would do, even if you could Rest off status, sometimes a timely paralysis/burn can be too annoying to waste a turn on Rest. Just keep that in mind.

Focus Blast from Gengar won't OHKO Snorlax certainly, but it will weaken it enough for something else to finish it off, if it times it correctly, so beware of that. I know it's 3v3, but a direct hit will not be pretty.

One question, but how would you deal with Machamp should your friend bring one? He's a tough mon to break, especially in this game where a Payback on a switch is double damage, so there goes your Gengar and 100% accurate Dynamicpunch is a nightmare.

[j2k15]

About Articuno, indeed if I use it, it'd be for late game only.

Some of my friends have pretty good level, other mediocre.

Myself, I'm learning about competitive play. So I read a lot.

The thing is that I'd like to try to win with Pokemon I like the most. Hence Ditto. The good thing is that mine has the item which doubles its speed.

But my main plan (in that case it's more in 6vs6 battles) would be to use it just after a strong battle where my Pokemon just fainted and the opponent is still there with low HP and preferably a status change. This would be the use case if I use it.

I did not know the mechanics of this move (Payback).

I'll read about it.

FYI, I stopped after Gen II and just restarted with Hearthgold 'cause I liked the original game.

[wraith89]

Warning: Ditto's Quick Powder only works during its untransformed state. You'll transform, but it will take the hit directly after. You will basically be fighting with an itemless Pokemon at that point. Just be cautious with it. You will copy every stat except HP, so it is in your best interest to maximise its HP. I don't discourage winning with your favourites: in fact I do that a lot, even if they are competitively subpar. I just know objectively it is very difficult to attempt it with Ditto. Perhaps a more general staple item like Leftovers/Lum Berry/Focus Sash would work on Ditto, I think. Quick Powder/Metal Powder has some problems ultimately I think, though it does do its job.

I believe your Exeggutor would deal well with Machamp, but confusion from Dynamicpunch is annoying. Slowbro with Own Tempo is the best response to it I think and can also deal with many other Pokemon such as Rock/Ground mons (beware of Rhyperior's Megahorn) and unsuspecting Steels with Fire Blast (beware of Scizor's Bug attacks). Speaking of Scizor, that thing can give you loads of trouble, especially since this is the game where Bullet Punch Technician Scizor was incredibly popular. You can pack a surprise Overheat on your Primeape for fun (or Fire Punch is also fine). I'm unsure how your friends play but a quick glance shows me how dangerous a well played and very popular Scizor can be to your team.

Articuno is quite difficult to use and I only use it in specific situations, despite it being my favourite Pokemon. Consider using Substitute + Roost to take advantage of Pressure and fire off Sheer Colds for fun. Sometimes even without Mind Reader it hits things. Though usually it is unnecessary and Ice Beam will finish off most Ice weak mons just fine, or slowly poison them with Toxic. It is sad but I think even Moltres does that job better because its typing is better defensively. But since Sheer Cold is what it has, you can try that. Most Pokemon with Sturdy (immune to Sheer Cold) already seem to be weak to Ice Beam anyways, so you can just use both in the same set. If only this was the newer games where Articuno also learns Freeze Dry, bulky waters would be no problem.

I'm one of those old guard too, but competitively it has become a bit more convoluted in the newer games. I played Gen IV extensively so I remember how most of the mechanics went.

[j2k15]

Hi,

Thanks a lot for the time you took to answer.

First, I want to come back on :

One question, but how would you deal with Machamp should your friend bring one? He's a tough mon to break, especially in this game where a Payback on a switch is double damage, so there goes your Gengar and 100% accurate Dynamicpunch is a nightmare.

Dynamicpunch is only 50% accurate. How do you make it 100% ?

For sure one of my friend will use Scizor and at least another one will use Steelix.

That' sur why for my Snorlax I wanted Fire Punch. Also to address Heracross which might be sent against my Snorlax.

For my Primeape, I planned to give him :

Expert Belt

U-turn (to escape from Psy's and still inflicting damages)

Ice Punch (for birds)

Close combat : power, accuracy, STAB

Earthquake (if not alteady used) / tunnel

For my Exeggutor, I was thinking of :

Leech Seed

Psyko : accuracy + STAB + power

Giga Drain : STAB + heal

Explosion : suicide move

I really want to leep leech seed. I was thinking of replacing Explosion by Toxik but it means 2 turns to set the strategy and knowing Exeggutor low speed, it might not survive 3 hits.

For the Dugtrio I'll read more about what you proposed. I did not know this strategy.

Other option is maybe to replace Explosion by Sleep Powder and start with that before Leech Seed. But sleeping powder is only 70% accurate. So it's still a risky plan.

[wraith89]

You are forgetting one of Machamp's ability "No Guard", which makes every moves, including the opponent's moves, 100% accurate while it is in play. This makes Machamp quite dangerous. This also means non-missing Stone Edge, even if your birds are Flying. In HGSS the Machop line is the only Pokemon with the ability No Guard.

If you want a fast Exeggutor you can try Sunny Day for a more offensive variant. Giga Drain is a little too weak in this game though, but it will OHKO any Rock/Grounds or things that are 4x weak to Grass. You could try Solarbeam with Sunny Day but that requires the sun, or Energy Ball for a decently powered Grass move.

Sleep Powder is a very good move on Exeggutor, even if it is 70% accurate (or was it 75%?), it's a lot better than Hypnosis. It could be helpful, but unfortunate misses really mess up everything. But that's what the game is: mostly risks. Sleep Powder is quite worth it though in my opinion. Of course, if you are fighting a Machamp with No Guard, it will become 100% accurate, like I pointed out earlier.

[j2k15]

I did not know this ability.

So indeed it's dangerous. Also for him if he faces one having a capacity like Fissure, ...

Indeed Energy Ball seems so great because of power, accuracy, STAB and the fact it's a special attack.

So I think I've my moveset defined for Exeggutor.

Sleeping Powder

Leech Seed

Psyko

Energy Ball / Leafstorm

Thanks for those advises. ;-)

[wraith89]

I realised you had a Primeape posted earlier. It is an okay set, but if you like, you can put a Choice Scarf to be faster or a Choice Band to hit harder, as that Primeape you have seems to be a hit and run Pokemon anyways. Just something to consider, unless being stuck with one attack is not your style. I guess Earthquake is to hit Nidoking/queen harder, but I think Stone Edge may give you a better coverage overall vs Fliers, although you have Ice Punch. In that case you can use Fire Punch. I usually do not run Ground with Fighting moves much because sometimes they are redundant with coverage. Just go with what you think is best.

I believe you can get additional TM26 (Earthquake) from having Level 100 Pickup mons pick them up, if I remember correctly. If you have the patience to train multiple Linoones or Meowths or something to Level 100, you can get more of those I believe.

For 3v3 Battles, if you are running Leaf Storm, consider placing a White Herb to recover from the SpA drop or put a Choice Scarf so you can unexpectedly outspeed something and surprise Leaf Storm them. You will also need the Choice Scarf to 1v1 Heracross, who will otherwise pose problems to some parts of your team.

Where are you from by the way? You seem to be someplace from Europe by the way you type.

[j2k15]

Indeed, a Choice item might be considered.

But look, I'm facing one Pokemon and triggers a move. The guy then directly changes to e.g a Psy. Then I'm stucked with first move and cannot use the U-turn against him.

So still need to think.

Another I'll think about is Omastar. Just got some Helix fossils. :-)

You mean when you reach level 100 you get some TM ?

Indeed, I'm from Europe. Belgium to be exact.

[wraith89]

Yes, well, Choice items are your choice. It is also a bit high in terms of skill play, but choice + U-turn is a popular strategy meant to annoy and bait and switch. Problem is using the wrong move with a choice item does mess up the momentum. So if you master it and prediction, it will be useful. Otherwise it does come at a high price. I do like Scarf at times because it makes a Pokemon unexpectedly faster than what is normally expected, but it also gives away the surprise after it is used. You can practice it though and it can become your best friend.

Omastar is good, but it really does require team support. Namely, a Pokemon that can help it set up rain because it does best in rain. It is hard to run one without rain. Just stick to a simple strategy and with Pokemon you like at the moment.

Yes, if you know how Pickup works, as you walk around or defeat wild Pokemon (I think), the Pokemon in your party with Pickup ability (things like Meowth/Zigzagoon/Aipom), assuming it had no items, will pick up a random item. Lower level ones will pick up things like Super Potion or some Berries, but as you level the Pokemon up, they get better items. I think you need them to be level 100 to have a chance at picking up a TM26. Then you can get multiple Earthquake TMs so it will not be a waste.

Cool, I have a friend from Belgium. He is near Brussels.

[j2k15]

Ha yes I know pickup but did not know it allows you to find that TM !

However I saw it's also available against Battle Points.

Yesterday I got old amber and soft resetted till I have a Jolly Aerodactyl.

I'll also train it.

I've also spend some time to get Power Item to increase Sp Att.

So I can easily start EV train my Gastly.