Pokemon Black 2 / White 2 Move Changes / Move Tutor Compatibility / All That is Competitive

**Delta Blast Burn** · Jun 22nd, 2012

Pokemon Level-Up Moves Changes:

Spoiler

Move Tutor Compatibility List:

Spoiler

TM Compatibility Changes:

Spoiler

Egg Move Changes:

Spoiler

New Formes

Spoiler

Original Post from Delta Blast Burn:

Spoiler

All opinions regarding anything competitive and whatnot can be discussed here.

Sources:

1. Smogon Discussion

2. Serebii.Net Movelist Changes List

**wraith89** · Jun 23rd, 2012

~~Can't believe I'm posting again~~
How about I change the discussion topic into the new moves for Pokemon?

I'm upset too, no Flare Blitz on Flareon. Sigh -___-
Also still no new moves for Vanilluxe nor any other coverage moves for Lilligant. Not that Lilligant is any bad, mind you...
Lol Heracross is able to Bulk Up again. They forgot to add compatibility for that in BW.

I am particularly excited that Sandshrew/Sandslash finally learn Earthquake... and even Swords Dance naturally, amongst others. I'll post my full thoughts later and add to the original post. Also, Hurricane Articuno & Moltres are great! Zapdos got trolled with Zap Cannon, lol. But that's still not enough to compensate for all the disparity done to the other two birds when Zapdos had all sorts of nice boosts.

EDIT: Look above: post is overhauled and looks much neater. Feel free to discuss.

**Lorshinator** · Jun 23rd, 2012

I accidentally forgot to post.

Things I like:
- Golurk's additions are sweet. Lots more coverage, and he can have some utility with SR. Sadly no boosting moves, but overall nice additions with Drain Punch, Elemental Punches, and the like.
- Cofagrigus' moves are nice as well. Pain split and Magic coat are nice additions.
- Throh's got some nice moves too. More coverage with elemental punches.
- Storm throw pinsir.

- Eelektross is even more versatile, and now he can do justice with giga drain instead of hidden power! (Which is weaker anyways and sacrifices some IVS, although at the cost of PP). Drain Punch, Knock Off, The elemental punches, all are quite nice. Obviously most of these moves cater physically, which I don't mind considering it's special is better anyways.
- Durant has super power. Everyone run.
- Articuno has hurricane.

- Haxorus does not get elemental punches, which means no fire punch.

Dislikes:
- Elemental punches on conkeldurr.
- Sky Upper cut on Gliscor... wut.
- No flare blitz flareon. D:

That's about it.

**wraith89** · Jun 23rd, 2012

Articuno and Dragonite... Y U NO GET HEAL BELL?!!
Is Gamefreak really doing this again? -____-

Escavalier gets nothing interesting, not even Superpower. Are they serious? :/

At least Klinklang gets Wild Charge, meaning Shift Gear + Return/Gear Grind/Wild Charge is viable.

Foul Play Mandibuzz and Umbreon ---> all of my yes

I do not like the distribution of Drill Run. It would have been useful on many others, some birds even. But no, it's given to many Pokemon who already learn the superior Earthquake or with low attack power. At least give it to Escavalier or things that look like it remotely can use it!

Monsters who learn it:

Spoiler

Also, Thick Fat Swinub is on DW, meaning we don't have to deal with an Ice Shard-less Thick Fat Mamoswine anymore!

Talk about non-parity:

Reshiram: Draco Meteor, Dragon Pulse, Earth Power, Heat Wave, Hyper Voice, Outrage, Roost, Sleep Talk, Snore, Tailwind, Zen Headbutt
Zekrom: Draco Meteor, Dragon Pulse, Earth Power, Hyper Voice, Magnet Rise, Outrage, Roost, Signal Beam, Sleep Talk, Snore, Tailwind, ThunderPunch, Zen Headbutt

No Fire Punch on Reshiram... meh not like it will ever find a use for it, but still... it looks awkward.

Oh one more thing... why in bloody tarnations does Heatmor not learn Flame Charge? It's the only Fire Pokemon that has this property, I think.

**Guested** · Jun 23rd, 2012

Guys. I don't know why no one has understood this yet.
Flareon doesn't want Flare Blitz!
A Pokemon that fragile with such low HP does NOT want a massive move with recoil. :/ It just can't handle it.

**wraith89** · Jun 23rd, 2012

I'm sorry, but Fire Fang does not cut it. Though I'm satisfied enough with running Fire Blast since most Steels hate the special side as opposed to the physical. One flaw with some competitive people is that they believe 95 SpA is inadequate. It's mighty high to me *shrugs*

Scarf it and it'll at least KO someone with it. Either way it is already getting revenged: what's worse than using Fire Fang only to get hit harder than what Flare Blitz's recoil would have done anyhow? Infernape has the fragile problem and doesn't mind running Flare Blitz. I suppose it can still use a physical Fire move that doesn't require recoil... maybe a new "Flame Tail" or something that's akin to Aqua Tail, idk. It's understandable why it cannot Fire Punch, but there needs to be some new physical Fire move for things like Flareon.

People only say Flare Blitz because it is the only Fire move that makes sense for it to learn, but still denied.

**Guested** · Jun 23rd, 2012

No, Fire Fang doesn't cut it. That's why you either put it in a position where its fire-type moves or attack stat can be boosted and use Fire Fang, OR just run something mixed with something else physical that isn't a Fire type move, and then use the special stat for something like Flamethrower, Fire Blast, Lava Plume, or Heat Wave for a fire attack. 95 in Special Attack isn't terrible.

**wraith89** · Jun 23rd, 2012

The problem with that is, many other Fires already are better in the special department and actually has speed and a better movepool to abuse, leaving Flareon with little to claim usage over them. You have to understand most people are trying to find a way to salvage Flareon to make it seem decently usable. In absolute terms, it has a role, but a Fire type with little speed and no physical defence to speak of is begging to be OHKOd by most of the metagame. It is usable though when you realise 110 SpDef goes a long way for it to survive some non-invested Surfs and has access to Wish, and that Superpower with Guts (now that it is allowed) helps for its wallbreaking capabilities, but it seems rather unfair that the amazing 130 Attack power has no physical STAB to abuse properly with but can only utilise Superpower, Return, Iron Tail, Fire Fang, Bite... At this point, it is begging for Flare Blitz, since it is the next best option, or until it exists, a more moderate 80-90 base power physical Fire attack.

Yes, 95 SpA isn't terrible: in fact, people forget Tyranitar has 95 SpA and still OHKOs Gliscor with Ice Beam, but it needs to be something other than a poor man's Entei, and that's BAD in competitive terms when you realise Entei is a poor version of Arcanine (what is with Gamefreak and "weaker than mundane creature" legendaries?). Only reason I use it is because I just like it and net a surprise kill on Tyranitar. (lol I want Zap Cannon on Flareon back)

I'm starting to think Gamefreak has some issues with Fire types, or actually Ice types, or both. Just look at that disparity between Electivire and Magmortar: just how is that fair? :/

Updated with forms section.

**Tbird** · Jul 4th, 2012

Roost Poison Heal Gliscor. Forget Sky Upper-Cut; the thing will be impossible to break down. when you consider that some things do still fail to OHKO it with Hidden Power Ice, all it has to do is Protect for a turn and roost the next to be back on almost full health, all the while scouting what your plan of action is. Gliscor was a bitch, anyway, now it's a bitch that can't be touched (to that end, maybe people will start running fast Glisc' again; I haven't agreed with the slow spread since I first saw it). However, this means that in UU Gligar can utilise Immunity and Roost, which to me seems to be fair enough.

Haxorus getting Low Kick and Super Power, this isn't good news. Though at least it didn't get fire punch? CB Set can now reek more havoc, expectant Ferro/Skarm Switch ins take a fat Super Power to the Face. However with the prevalence of the new Genie forms, Haxorus is going to want to be careful spamming Superpower, given that Tornadus-T will set up on it and start killing stuff. Haxorus also got Aqua Tail, though, which I imagine is going to be a pain if it's got a CB + Rain Boost.

And What about Outrage + Moxie + DD Mence? This could be a bit of fun, or hell even just CS + Outrage and Moxie. Mence is seeming a little underwelming though, given that pretty much every pokemon is carrying Hidden Power Ice, and if they aren't they're a dragon type anyway... and the Genies are just trollingly fast.

Mamoswine should prove to be quite cool, with thick fat, and priority to stop the new Genies. CB Ice Shard KOs them after Rocks?

Talking about the Genies, the new Thunderus looks like it could run a scary set of Nasty Plot / Thunder(bolt) / Hidden Power Ice / Focus Blast (Super Power) Quite similar to its old staple set, just with ability to kick the good shite out of Blissey and Tyranitar more reliably.

All the rage seems to be about rain teams now, the heat only let off of rain a little anyway,m but now it seems to be in full force. Like a few other people I'm hoping we can see an unban of Garchomp / Excadrill just to keep these rain mons in check. Hell just gimme Garchomp back.

Anyway that's what I've taken from this so far, not had a fully in depth look just yet.

**wraith89** · Jul 4th, 2012

Everyone's been talking about Gliscor usage sky-rocketing due to Roost + Poison Heal, but 4 move slot makes it a little difficult to fit it, since people are used to Protect. Expect Ice Punch Conkeldurr to rise in usage as well just to deal with Gliscor. I guess, though, one could run Roost/Protect/Ice Fang/Earthquake but there's so much potential missed out on that. I don't know: we will see. Gliscor will rise though certainly.

Haxorus is going to OHKO-2HKO everything in OU now, even Skarmory. Aqua Tail and Superpower makes it very hard to switch into. Aqua Tail will even hit your Storm Drain Gastrodons, due to Mold Breaker. Why does it even need Fire Punch anyways when it can take down even Skarmory now?

Before, Salamence could only have either DD or Outrage with Moxie. Now that it has both, this will be a monster to take down. 100 Speed is still quite fast, and after a DD, only stuff like Choiced Trololos brothers or Scarf Lati@s could revenge it. Moxie Outrage is overhyped, but it is still quite the dangerous monster and I imagine may have a chance of ban.

Thick Fat Mamoswine is going to be a prime revenger in this metagame now, thanks to the influx of many Ice-weak Pokemon. Ice Shard still does its job, and best of all, Mamoswine will not be weak to Fire Blast anymore. It can also work in rain teams, as it will somewhat resist Fire moves (though taking more from Water, which there's plenty of waters to wall that anyways), but just like how Azumarill was anti-metagame in early BW, I think Mamoswine will work similarly. Also handles Gliscor fairly well with Icicle Crash.

I'm rather excited about Tornadus-T. It's weaker than the regular Tornadus, but due to Regenerator and that incredible speed, and access to U-turn, what's a little SR weakness going to do anyways? However the other two Therian forms don't seem quite promising. Thundurus lost 10 base speed and even Prankster so it doesn't get priority Nasty Plot anymore. It's still quite fast, but it doesn't troll Gengar anymore. At least it has immunity to electric moves. Landorus with Intimidate... you'd think it's quite good. It is better than Incarnate Landorus in non-sand teams, but otherwise, regular Landorus has more speed and Sand Power pretty much means that attack boost Landorus-T gained is a lost cause. I could see a bulky Landorus-T set coming to use to abuse Intimidate and the likes, but there's no access to Roost, making it a little difficult.

Rain teams? Rain is a very powerful weather, but I still think Sand dominates OU. Currently trying the new Hurricane Articuno to keep Grassers that mess up Rain teams in check: it works wonderfully as it has the bulk to take most assaults and walling STAB Hurricane is difficult. Pressure keeps enemy Fire Blast / Stone Edges to have 4 tries to hit, sometimes failing, and things like Virizion has a 4x weakness to Flying, even with that crazy 129 SpDef, it is not walling Hurricane anytime soon. Those Smogoners who said Articuno is too weak... why do they always insist 95 SpA is weak? They're forgetting that's also Tyranitar's SpA rating. I may try Hurricane Moltres sometime too, but I have to make sure it isn't an "inferior Volcarona" by capitalising its typing and bulk.

**PokePoindexter** · Jul 7th, 2012

Ninetales gets Foul Play? Sweetness! Frankly, I always thought Umbreon would benefit from this too, but I guess he would be expected to be able to use it if it became a MT move, since he's a Dark-type himself.

Thread: Pokemon Black 2 / White 2 Move Changes / Move Tutor Compatibility / All That is Competitive

Thread Tools

Pokemon Black 2 / White 2 Move Changes / Move Tutor Compatibility / All That is Competitive

Re: New Pokemon Moves

Re: Pokemon Black 2 / White 2 Move Changes / Move Tutor Compatibility / All That is Competitive

Re: Pokemon Black 2 / White 2 Move Changes / Move Tutor Compatibility / All That is Competitive

Re: Pokemon Black 2 / White 2 Move Changes / Move Tutor Compatibility / All That is Competitive

Re: Pokemon Black 2 / White 2 Move Changes / Move Tutor Compatibility / All That is Competitive

Re: Pokemon Black 2 / White 2 Move Changes / Move Tutor Compatibility / All That is Competitive

Re: Pokemon Black 2 / White 2 Move Changes / Move Tutor Compatibility / All That is Competitive

Re: Pokemon Black 2 / White 2 Move Changes / Move Tutor Compatibility / All That is Competitive

Re: Pokemon Black 2 / White 2 Move Changes / Move Tutor Compatibility / All That is Competitive

Re: Pokemon Black 2 / White 2 Move Changes / Move Tutor Compatibility / All That is Competitive

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions